I loved this thoughtful, insightful and sensitive newsletter post. Wow! Twice, at memorial services, I learned so much more about loved ones I thought I knew. People I didn’t know spoke about my father and years later my former significant other. Years earlier I’d learned in a sociology class that we have different personas for the various roles we play in our lives. That goes for people too, in my opinion. Chemistry, among other things, plays a role in our connections, as well. Or so I’ve come to believe. Betsy’s entry this week, as always, is beautifully written. Thank you.
This sounds intriguing Elizabeth. I'm endlessly fascinated by the levels of denial and fantasy that live in relationships, and how we can convince ourselves black is white if it's what we need to believe in that moment. Adding this novel to my TBR list 😊
I read Wuthering Heights in high school. Loved it, probably in part because it hinted at things I didn't know about my own 18-year-old self. Since then I've visited Howarth, home of the Brontes, wandered out on the moors, and felt the same mix of wonder and desolation triggered by the book. I plan to read it again. But to avoid the film; most of the reviews are awful.
That's so interesting, Joan. I want to write a novella next -- two or three that go together. These would be fiction, of course, but I think you're saying that I'm sitting on some material you'd be interested in? Thanks for chiming in.
Lately, people have been asking me about writing memoir which is something I've never minded doing in essay form here and there.
Joan I agree. I posted this comment to Betsy’s last post: ‘You are a great ‘life’ writer. Selfishly, it is something I would like more of.🐰’ Relationships are what fascinate me and if one had the time to go through Betsy’s substack archive I suspect there are probably enough anecdotes there already to fill that novella you (and me) would like to see!🐰
Betsy, you got me thinking about mystery in marriage. After more than 50 years with my husband, we don’t discover meaningful information about each other’s lives. We’ve shared all the stories. Each of us often knows what the other is about to say. What keeps this marriage interesting is the never-ending conversation about the changing worlds we live in, both public and private.
As we age, we too are changing. We two known, beloved partners are grappling with the unforeseen physical vulnerabilities of life in our 70s. We are crankier versions of the people we’ve always been. There are new things to know about each other.
P.S. Thank you for inviting me to share a book I loved with your community.
Yes to all of this, Rona. My husband and I know each other's stories (or at least I can say I know most of his). Like you both, we talk all the time about everything around us including our aging selves. Every now and then, though, I find myself wondering how close his perceptions of himself and me are to mine of him and myself. If that makes sense. If he had to describe me and what makes me, well, me. I am not entirely sure what he might say. Not sure that's even important but now I'm wondering if it is something to find out.
And thank YOU for sharing a book that you loved. This is turning out to be a really rewarding project for me. I hope it is for others too!
Oh my goodness, so much to think about here, and so much to say...I'll start at the end of your post—I find Wuthering Heights to be a good book but not a great book, and I can't believe that the new film cast a white actor as Heathcliff, not as the mixed race orphan in a world of entitled "white" people in a very racist society that he was. I think that storyline is the most underdeveloped part of the book and the previous films. I have not seen it and do not plan to--not because of that, but in addition to the poor reviews. Regarding the Atwood book, of course I will be reading that. I enjoyed reading Kin (got an ARC from the publisher) and will be reviewing it soon. It is a very good book and quite unlike an American Marriage, which I LOVED. I think it may affect many readers (especially women, IMHO) even more strongly.
As to discovering secrets or seeing previously unknown parts of a person we love and live with, I can't imagine it not happening. Russel and I have known each other for over 50 years, are edging close to 37 years of marriage (in late May), and have shared a lot of stories over the years, but I sometimes will still tell a story or a joke he hasn't heard. If he remarks on it, I fall back on my old brag: "I got a million of them!" I look forward to his unshared-so-far tales.
And finally, I also had a terrible boyfriend who was charming, abusive, and violent, so that story resonated with me. He was also a star of sorts (a much-admired athlete in a small SoCal circle) and I was slow to realize he was a sociopath; his jealousy still seemed laughable to me until he threatened my life. I've been trying to write about it, but so far, it falls flat, mostly because I am unwilling to use his name or enough info for someone who knows him to recognize him. But I sort of feel I SHOULD write about him, even if it serves as nothing more than a cautionary tale. Thanks for all the food for thought!
Hi Jen, just watched you and the other brilliant women of WHAM! BAM! THANK YOU! SLAM! as you read your stories. It was a lot of fun to see you as you told your story after all these years of mostly reading you. You were wonderful!
I really appreciated AMERICAN MARRIAGE as well and when I saw that this one seemed to focus on the idea of the families we make as well as the ones we are born into, I was in.
I won't be seeing the new movie either. I will likely try the book again just to see why I had such a powerful reaction the first time.
As for bad boyfriends -- they don't always make for the best stories, at least for me. It takes a long time to get the necessary distance and I'm not sure I could write it with the empathy I'd like towards either of us. It's valuable, though, if you are writing it to work something out for yourself and let others know that they are/were not alone.
Yes, that's the only reason I'd write it, to inspire others to leave the bad boyfriend. I write a super short essay and submitted it recently. We'll see what happens.
So glad you enjoyed the slam. What fun! I worked without a net, meaning notes, and it was surprisingly easy.
I think everyone was reading theirs. In general, I think most slams and story telling events are not noteless, though the Moth is always "told live, without notes." I just decided to try it without for fun...and because it's easier to connect with the audience, which is already difficult on Zoom.
I treasure our Saturday 'conversations' with rumination that so often align with mine. Your introspections buoy me and spur me to ponder on my own. Keep on keeping on, Betsy Marro.
Knowing a person, to me, is akin to that almost completed picture puzzle lying on the folding table in the den, that challenges you to put all of those strangely cut pieces together. It begins with those pieces that are easily identifiable, while other parts of the puzzle require more observation and more scrutiny. Sometimes the puzzle needs to sit for a time while your eyes readjust and you retake a seat in front of it, looking for better light and/or a new position. Sometimes the pieces may even be lost and never found, but the puzzle, nearly finished, is joy enough.
I like to think of myself as an open book, ready and willing to answer any questions from my spouse, and if I receive the same consideration from him; that's enough for me.
Yes. This is making me think that perhaps the most difficult thing to know, if not impossible, is how one person views/understands the other. Sometimes when my husband asks a question, I get the idea that he's correcting a bit of the puzzle.
I loved this thoughtful, insightful and sensitive newsletter post. Wow! Twice, at memorial services, I learned so much more about loved ones I thought I knew. People I didn’t know spoke about my father and years later my former significant other. Years earlier I’d learned in a sociology class that we have different personas for the various roles we play in our lives. That goes for people too, in my opinion. Chemistry, among other things, plays a role in our connections, as well. Or so I’ve come to believe. Betsy’s entry this week, as always, is beautifully written. Thank you.
This sounds intriguing Elizabeth. I'm endlessly fascinated by the levels of denial and fantasy that live in relationships, and how we can convince ourselves black is white if it's what we need to believe in that moment. Adding this novel to my TBR list 😊
I read Wuthering Heights in high school. Loved it, probably in part because it hinted at things I didn't know about my own 18-year-old self. Since then I've visited Howarth, home of the Brontes, wandered out on the moors, and felt the same mix of wonder and desolation triggered by the book. I plan to read it again. But to avoid the film; most of the reviews are awful.
I definitely won’t be seeing the film, at least this latest one. I will re-read WH though. I’m curious about how it will strike me now.
Read Elif Shafak’s last post - it is all about love and its many guises. An excellent piece.🐰
I will!
Betsy, your introductory comments about your younger self were at least as intriguing & compelling as the novel of X.
Is there at least a novella there?
I guess many of us have outlier memories that help us relate easily tho a tad uncomfortably.
Thank you.
🌿🩵🌿Joan Stein
That's so interesting, Joan. I want to write a novella next -- two or three that go together. These would be fiction, of course, but I think you're saying that I'm sitting on some material you'd be interested in? Thanks for chiming in.
Lately, people have been asking me about writing memoir which is something I've never minded doing in essay form here and there.
Joan I agree. I posted this comment to Betsy’s last post: ‘You are a great ‘life’ writer. Selfishly, it is something I would like more of.🐰’ Relationships are what fascinate me and if one had the time to go through Betsy’s substack archive I suspect there are probably enough anecdotes there already to fill that novella you (and me) would like to see!🐰
So much to think about here, and I especially liked this line: "People, however, are not meant to be solved."
Thank you, Andromeda. It has taken me a while to realize this, I think.
Betsy, you got me thinking about mystery in marriage. After more than 50 years with my husband, we don’t discover meaningful information about each other’s lives. We’ve shared all the stories. Each of us often knows what the other is about to say. What keeps this marriage interesting is the never-ending conversation about the changing worlds we live in, both public and private.
As we age, we too are changing. We two known, beloved partners are grappling with the unforeseen physical vulnerabilities of life in our 70s. We are crankier versions of the people we’ve always been. There are new things to know about each other.
P.S. Thank you for inviting me to share a book I loved with your community.
Yes to all of this, Rona. My husband and I know each other's stories (or at least I can say I know most of his). Like you both, we talk all the time about everything around us including our aging selves. Every now and then, though, I find myself wondering how close his perceptions of himself and me are to mine of him and myself. If that makes sense. If he had to describe me and what makes me, well, me. I am not entirely sure what he might say. Not sure that's even important but now I'm wondering if it is something to find out.
And thank YOU for sharing a book that you loved. This is turning out to be a really rewarding project for me. I hope it is for others too!
Sometimes my husband drives me crazy, but he understands me, makes me laugh and never bores me.
Oh my goodness, so much to think about here, and so much to say...I'll start at the end of your post—I find Wuthering Heights to be a good book but not a great book, and I can't believe that the new film cast a white actor as Heathcliff, not as the mixed race orphan in a world of entitled "white" people in a very racist society that he was. I think that storyline is the most underdeveloped part of the book and the previous films. I have not seen it and do not plan to--not because of that, but in addition to the poor reviews. Regarding the Atwood book, of course I will be reading that. I enjoyed reading Kin (got an ARC from the publisher) and will be reviewing it soon. It is a very good book and quite unlike an American Marriage, which I LOVED. I think it may affect many readers (especially women, IMHO) even more strongly.
As to discovering secrets or seeing previously unknown parts of a person we love and live with, I can't imagine it not happening. Russel and I have known each other for over 50 years, are edging close to 37 years of marriage (in late May), and have shared a lot of stories over the years, but I sometimes will still tell a story or a joke he hasn't heard. If he remarks on it, I fall back on my old brag: "I got a million of them!" I look forward to his unshared-so-far tales.
And finally, I also had a terrible boyfriend who was charming, abusive, and violent, so that story resonated with me. He was also a star of sorts (a much-admired athlete in a small SoCal circle) and I was slow to realize he was a sociopath; his jealousy still seemed laughable to me until he threatened my life. I've been trying to write about it, but so far, it falls flat, mostly because I am unwilling to use his name or enough info for someone who knows him to recognize him. But I sort of feel I SHOULD write about him, even if it serves as nothing more than a cautionary tale. Thanks for all the food for thought!
Hi Jen, just watched you and the other brilliant women of WHAM! BAM! THANK YOU! SLAM! as you read your stories. It was a lot of fun to see you as you told your story after all these years of mostly reading you. You were wonderful!
I really appreciated AMERICAN MARRIAGE as well and when I saw that this one seemed to focus on the idea of the families we make as well as the ones we are born into, I was in.
I won't be seeing the new movie either. I will likely try the book again just to see why I had such a powerful reaction the first time.
As for bad boyfriends -- they don't always make for the best stories, at least for me. It takes a long time to get the necessary distance and I'm not sure I could write it with the empathy I'd like towards either of us. It's valuable, though, if you are writing it to work something out for yourself and let others know that they are/were not alone.
Yes, that's the only reason I'd write it, to inspire others to leave the bad boyfriend. I write a super short essay and submitted it recently. We'll see what happens.
So glad you enjoyed the slam. What fun! I worked without a net, meaning notes, and it was surprisingly easy.
I meant to ask — is this something slammers are expected to do— to perform the story without notes or reading?
I think everyone was reading theirs. In general, I think most slams and story telling events are not noteless, though the Moth is always "told live, without notes." I just decided to try it without for fun...and because it's easier to connect with the audience, which is already difficult on Zoom.
I treasure our Saturday 'conversations' with rumination that so often align with mine. Your introspections buoy me and spur me to ponder on my own. Keep on keeping on, Betsy Marro.
Thanks, PJ, that's so kind. I will keep going, for sure. At least for now!
Your posts are always so, so rich. Thanks, Betsy.
Thank you, Stephanie. I am glad you found something in it that resonated with you. It means a lot when someone takes the time to tell me that.
Knowing a person, to me, is akin to that almost completed picture puzzle lying on the folding table in the den, that challenges you to put all of those strangely cut pieces together. It begins with those pieces that are easily identifiable, while other parts of the puzzle require more observation and more scrutiny. Sometimes the puzzle needs to sit for a time while your eyes readjust and you retake a seat in front of it, looking for better light and/or a new position. Sometimes the pieces may even be lost and never found, but the puzzle, nearly finished, is joy enough.
I like to think of myself as an open book, ready and willing to answer any questions from my spouse, and if I receive the same consideration from him; that's enough for me.
Yes. This is making me think that perhaps the most difficult thing to know, if not impossible, is how one person views/understands the other. Sometimes when my husband asks a question, I get the idea that he's correcting a bit of the puzzle.